Manchester To London Train To Run Without Passengers
The title of this post, is the same as that of this article on the BBC.
This is the sub-heading.
A train service taking commuters from Manchester to London is to run empty for around five months following a decision by the rail regulator.
These three paragraphs add more detail.
A decision by the Office of Rail and Road (ORR), means the 07:00 GMT service operated by Avanti West Coast from Manchester Piccadilly to London will still run but will only be used to carry staff from mid-December.
An Avanti West Coast spokesperson said they were “disappointed” with the decision, which would “clearly impact those customers who already use these services”.
An ORR spokesperson said the decision was made on “robust evidence” from Network Rail to guard against possible service disruption on the West Coast Main Line.
It is a long article on the BBC and I suspect, it is one of those, that should be fully-read before commenting.
I looked up last Friday’s service and found this.
- It was an eleven-coach Class 390 train.
- The train goes via Macclesfield, Stoke-on-Trent and Stafford, but only stops to pick up passengers at Stockport.
- It left on time at 07:00.
- It arrived in London at 09:20, which was twenty-one minutes late.
I think, I’ll see this train arrive on Monday.
Could Avanti West Coast Be Planning A Fast Service From Both Liverpool and Manchester?
Consider.
- Manchester Piccadilly has a 07:00 train to Euston, that takes two hours via Stoke-on-Trent.
- The train also stops at Stockport.
- The Manchester Piccadilly train is an eleven-car Class 390 train, that is 265.3 metres long.
- Liverpool Lime Street has a 06:43 train to Euston, that takes two hours and 11 minutes via Crewe, that stops at Runcorn.
- The Liverpool Lime Street train is a seven-car Class 807 train, that is 182 metres long.
Note.
- I wonder, if at some time in the future, these two services could both be run by seven-car Class 807 trains, that joined at Crewe.
- This might not have been possible with Class 390 trains, as the pair of trains would have been very long.
- Class 390 trains may not be able to split and join.
- I don’t think any extra paths would be needed.
This would give Crewe, Liverpool, Manchester, Runcorn and Stockport, a fast early train to Euston.
Do Hitachi Battery Electric InterCity Trains Have Problems?
I asked Google the question in the title of this post and got this answer.
While Hitachi’s battery-powered intercity trains have shown promising results in trials, particularly regarding fuel savings and emissions reduction, there are some potential challenges and considerations. These include safety concerns related to lithium battery fires, especially in the event of a crash or derailment, as well as range limitations for longer journeys. However, the technology is continuously evolving, and Hitachi is actively working to address these issues.
That seems fairly positive.
There is also this article on the BBC, which everybody should read, which is entitled Will New Battery-Powered Trains Replace Diesel, And Are They Safe?.
In The Data Sheet For Hitachi Battery Electric Trains, I look at the data sheet, that Hitachi published in late 2023.
These were my conclusions about the data sheet.
These are my conclusions about Hitachi’s battery packs for Class 80x trains, which were written in November 2023.
- The battery pack has a capacity of 750 kWh.
- A five-car train needs three battery-packs to travel 100 miles.
- A nine-car train needs five battery-packs to travel 100 miles.
- The maximum range of a five-car train with three batteries is 117 miles.
- The maximum range of a nine-car train with five batteries is 121 miles.
As battery technology gets better, these distances will increase.
Hitachi have seen my figures.
They also told me, that they were in line with their figures, but new and better batteries would increase range.
125 mph trains with a 120 mile range on batteries, would revolutionise UK train travel.
LNER’s Class 897 Trains
In the Wikipedia entry for LNER, this is said about LNER’s new ten CAF tri-mode trains.
In November 2023, LNER placed an order for 10 ten-car tri-mode (electric, diesel and battery power) Civity trains from CAF. In August 2024, it was announced that the units will be designated Class 897 under TOPS.
According to their Wikipedia entry, it appears the Class 897 trains will be delivered from 2027.
Can I Build A Schedule For The Introduction Of New Trains, Services and Batteries?
I think that I can from the information that is out there.
- East Coast Main Line – December 2025 – Introduction of Lumo between London King’s Cross and Glasgow
- West Coast Main Line – Spring 2026 – Introduction of Lumo between London Euston and Stirling
- Midland Main Line – 2026-2027 – Introduction of EMR Class 810 trains between London St. Pancras and Leicester, Derby, Nottingham and Sheffield.
- East Coast Main Line – From 2027 – Introduction of LNER Class 897 trains between London King’s Cross and Yorkshire.
Note.
- The two Lumo services use trains already in service.
- The Class 810 trains for EMR are being debugged and introduced at the present time.
- The only new trains are the Class 897 trains for LNER.
- The introduction of the Class 897 trains will allow LNER to withdraw some trains for refurbishment and fitting of batteries.
This would mean that before the next general election, almost the full timetable between London and the North of England and Scotland would have been implemented using diesel-electric technology.
Is it a low-risk start to the full electrification of services to the North?
The second-phase would see battery-electric trains introduced.
I believe that Grand Central’s new trains would be brought into service first.
- The new trains are scheduled to be introduced in 2028.
- Grand Central will still have the diesel trains for backup.
- Their new trains would be similar to the other Hitachi trains.
- It looks like they could be doing some splitting and joining.
After the Grand Central trains had been introduced successfully, the trains for the other Hitachi operators would have batteries fitted.
I suspect short routes like Lincoln would be electrified with battery-electric trains first.
There would also need to be short lengths of electrification erected, so that trains could be charged to send them on their way.
Other routes could also be electrified in the same way.
- Basingstoke and Exeter
- Birmingham and Aberystwyth
- Bristol and Penzance
- Cardiff and Swansea
- Crewe and Holyhead
- Edinburgh and Aberdeen
- Edinburgh and Inverness
- Reading and Taunton
- Swindon and Gloucester
If this technique could work for main lines, surely a scaled down version with smaller trains would work for branch lines.
Conclusion
Consider.
- It looks to me, that someone has planned this thoroughly.
- It all fits together extremely well.
It could be the first phase of a cunning plan to use battery-electric trains to electrify the UK’s railways.
Passengers will also see benefits, from when Lumo runs its first train into Glasgow Queen Street station.
I don’t think Hitachi’s trains have any problems, but there is enough float in this plan to make sure, it can be implemented on time and on budget.
Could London And Central Scotland Air Passengers Be Persuaded To Use The Trains?
How Many Passengers Fly Between London And Edinburgh?
Wikipedia gives these figures for 2024 for passengers from Edinburgh to London
- London City – 334,873
- London Gatwick – 476,152
- London Heathrow – 1,148,634
- London Luton – 338, 729
- London Stansted – 693,953
This gives a total of 2,992,341.
As Wikipedia doesn’t give complete figures for from London to Edinburgh, for the purpose of this analysis, I’ll assume they are the same.
How Many Passengers Fly Between London And Glasgow?
Wikipedia gives these figures for 2024 for passengers from Glasgow to London
- London City – 208,405
- London Gatwick – 456,002
- London Heathrow – 954,027
- London Luton – 255,095
- London Stansted – 225,110
This gives a total of 2,098,639.
As Wikipedia doesn’t give complete figures for from London to Glasgow, for the purpose of this analysis, I’ll assume they are the same.
How Many Passengers Fly Between London And Scotland’s Central Belt?
Adding the two figures gives 5,090,980. in both directions.
Which is an average of 97,903 per week or 13,948 per day.
How Many Train Seats Run Between London And Scotland’s Central Belt?
These figures are for Friday the 1st of August.
- Aventi West Coast – London Euston and Glasgow Central – 5 x 9-car Class 390 train – 2,345 seats
- Aventi West Coast – London Euston and Glasgow Central – 16 x 11-car Class 390 train – 6,677 seats
- LNER – London King’s Cross and Edinburgh – 26 x 9-car Class 801 train – 15,886 seats
- Lumo – London King’s Cross and Edinburgh – 5 x 5-car Class 803 train – 2,010 seats
Note.
- All services are all-electric.
- All services are fairly new or have recently been refurbished,
This gives a total of 26,918 train seats.
Adding Lumo’s Service To Glasgow
In Lumo Will Extend Its King’s Cross And Edinburgh Service To Glasgow, I suggested that the Glasgow service would be run as follows from December 2025.
- Two existing Lumo services will leave London as pairs of five-car trains.
- The pairs will split at Edinburgh.
- The leading train will go on to Glasgow Queen Street calling at Edinburgh Haymarket and Falkirk High stations.
- The trailing train will return to London King’s Cross.
- At the end of the day, the two trains in Glasgow will do a fast run back to London King’s Cross as a pair of 5-car trains.
This will add 804 seats per day between London and Glasgow Queen Street in both directions.
The daily total would now total 27,722 train seats, which compares with a daily average of 13,948 passengers per day, who travel by air.
Adding Lumo’s Service To Stirling
In Lumo To Expand Scotland’s Rail Network With New London-Stirling Rail Route From Spring 2026, I talk about Lumo’s new service to Stirling.
- There will be five trains per day (tpd) in each direction.
- Lumo’s new route will link London Euston directly to Stirling, also calling at Milton Keynes, Nuneaton, Crewe, Preston, Carlisle, Lockerbie, Motherwell, Whifflet (serving Coatbridge), Greenfaulds (serving Cumbernauld) and Larbert.
- The service will use 6-car Class 222 trains, which in the linked post, I estimate will have a similar one-class capacity to the Class 803 trains between London King’s Cross and Edinburgh.
- If the capacity of the two train types is similar, this should give operational advantages and allow some more Class 803 trains to run the Euston and Stirling route.
This second Scottish route will add 2010 train seats per day between London Euston and Stirling in both directions.
The daily total would now total 29,732 train seats, which compares with a daily average of 13,948 passengers per day, who travel by air.
Could More Capacity Be Added Between London And Scotland’s Central Belt?
I believe some of the Lumo services between London King’s Cross and Edinburgh could be doubled up to a pair of trains.
There would have to be no platform length issues at London King’s Cross, Stevenage, Newcastle and Morpeth stations.
If three trains could be doubled up, that would add 1,206 train seats per day between London and Edinburgh in both directions.
The daily total would now total 30,938 train seats, which compares with a daily average of 13,948 passengers per day, who travel by air.
I also suspect, that some of the Stirling services could be doubled up.
Connectivity Of England’s Northern Airports To London And Central Scotland
Birmingham Airport
Consider.
- There are easyJet flights to Edinburgh and Glasgow
- There are 1.5 trains per hour (tph) between Birmingham New Street and Edinburgh.
- There are 6 tpd between Birmingham New Street and Glasgow.
You would make your choice and pay the money.
East Midlands Airport
There are no flights or trains to Edinburgh and Glasgow.
Leeds Airport
Consider.
- There are no flights to Edinburgh or Glasgow.
- There is one tph between Leeds and Edinburgh
- There is one tpd between Leeds and Glasgow
Could Leeds and Glasgow get better connectivity?
Liverpool Airport
Consider.
- There are no flights to Edinburgh or Glasgow.
- There is one tph between Liverpool Lime Street and Edinburgh
- There is three tpd between Liverpool Lime Street and Glasgow
The Liverpool area is well connected to Crewe, Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western and Preston stations on the West Coast Main Line for alternative services to Glasgow.
Manchester Airport
Consider.
- There are no flights to Edinburgh or Glasgow.
- There is one tph between Manchester Airport and Scotland via Manchester Piccadilly and Manchester Oxford Road, which alternates between Edinburgh and Glasgow.
The Manchester area is well connected to Crewe, Warrington Bank Quay, Wigan North Western and Preston stations on the West Coast Main Line for alternative services to Glasgow.
Omio gives this summary of flights between Heathrow and Manchester airports.
Flights from Manchester Airport to London Heathrow Airport depart on average 8 times per day, taking around 1h 6m. Cheap flight tickets for this journey start at £63 but you can travel from only £16 by coach.
Wrightbus and others will be producing mouse-quiet hydrogen-powered coaches in a couple of years. I suspect these will give short flights a good kicking.
Newcastle Airport
Consider.
- There are no flights to Edinburgh or Glasgow.
- There is three tph between Newcastle and Edinburgh with an additional 5 tpd from Lumo.
- There is two tpd between Newcastle and Glasgow.
- There is one tpd between Newcastle and Stirling.
- From December 2025, Lumo will add two tpd from Newcastle to Glasgow and one tpd from Glasgow to Newcastle.
- In Lumo Will Extend Its King’s Cross And Edinburgh Service To Glasgow, I stated that I believe that Lumo’s Glasgow to Newcastle service will be a late evening ten-car train, so travellers can have a long day in Glasgow, Edinburgh and Newcastle and still return to London.
Lumo would appear to fill in the gap between Newcastle and Glasgow.
Google AI gives this summary of flights between Heathrow and Newcastle airports.
There are usually 5-6 direct flights per day between Newcastle and Heathrow airports. These flights are operated by British Airways. The average flight time is around 1 hour and 10 minutes.
Note.
- In 2024, 497, 469 passengers flew between between Heathrow and Newcastle airports, which is an average of 681 passengers in each direction every day.
- This was an increase of 13.6 % on 2023.
- From December Lumo will be running extra London King’s Cross and Newcastle services, with each train having 402 seats.
- The improvements in rail services in and around Newcastle in recent months, will surely bring more passengers to use trains from Newcastle station.
- Will Lumo also target adverts at airline passengers?
London and Newcastle could be another route for mouse-quiet hydrogen-powered coaches.
Conclusion
These numbers summarise my calculations.
- Currently an average of 13,948 passengers per day fly between London and Central Scotland.
- Currently, there are 26,918 train seats available per day between London and Central Scotland.
- In December 2025, Lumo will add another 804 low-cost train seats between London King’s Cross and Glasgow Queen Street.
- In Spring 2026, Lumo will add 2010 low-cost train seats between London Euston and Stirling.
- From Spring 2026, there will be 29,732 train seats available per day between London and Central Scotland.
- This represents a 10 % increase of seats on the trains between London and Central Scotland.
How many passengers, who normally fly, will switch to using the train?
- Lumo may only offer one class, but you get a trolley and can order food from M & S and others to be delivered to your seat.
- Both LNER and Lumo accept dogs. I don’t know about Avanti.
- All services will be all-electric, when Lumo gets its new electric trains for Stirling, in a few years.
- It looks to me like Lumo could be offering a late train back to London from Edinburgh and Glasgow.
- Digital signalling on the East Coast Main Line should speed up services.
If Lumo to Glasgow and Stirling works out, it could also cut the total carbon footprint of travel between London and Central Scotland.
Lumo Will Extend Its King’s Cross And Edinburgh Service To Glasgow
This article on the BBC is entitled New Train Services Approved On East Coast Main Line.
This is the sub-heading.
Additional train services will run on the East Coast Main Line from December, the rail regulator has said.
This will be the additional services for Lumo according to this document from the Office of Road and Rail.
- Lumo (Newcastle): one additional return service between London King’s Cross and Newcastle on weekdays and one additional service in opposing directions on a Saturday and Sunday.
- Lumo (Glasgow extensions): the extension of existing London King’s Cross-Edinburgh services so that Lumo can provide two northbound services and one southbound service between London King’s Cross and Glasgow on weekdays and one in each direction on Sundays.
I have some thoughts.
Train Lengths
The Office of Road and Rail document doesn’t mention train lengths.
- Hull Trains have been running most services as five-car trains, with some running as ten-car trains.
- In Ten-Car Hull Trains, I talked about Hull Trains and their mixing of 5- and 10-car trains and how it increased the number of seats on the route by 16.7 %.
I suspect that Lumo will use pairs of trains on some services to increase and also balance the number of seats.
A Possible Timetable
Consider.
- Currently, there are five Northbound trains every day with five Southbound trains on Monday to Saturday and four on Sunday.
- Lumo seem to run a reliable service.
- Would it be a safe and sensible idea to base the new timetable on the current timetable?
- Perhaps, the Glasgow services could be add-ons to the current timetable.
So it looks to me, that the extra trains will be scheduled using an innovative timetable.
- I wouldn’t be surprised if the Glasgow to London King’s Cross train was a pair of trains in the evening to balance the service and get two trains to London King’s Cross for the start of the next day’s services.
- This would also give travellers as long a day as possible in Glasgow.
- Would the two London King’s Cross to Glasgow trains, start as a pair of trains at London King’s Cross that split at Edinburgh, with one train returning to London King’s Cross and the other going on to Glasgow?
- Glasgow gets ten cars per day from London King’s Cross and sends ten cars back to London King’s Cross.
- Could the Sunday services both be a pair of trains?
The only new paths needed for the service, would be.
- Two between Edinburgh and Glasgow.
- One Southbound between Glasgow and London King’s Cross at the end of the day.
Otherwise the main timetable is as it is now.
How Long Will London King’s Cross and Glasgow Take?
Consider.
- The fastest Lumo trains take around 4 hours and 23 minutes between London and Edinburgh.
- The fastest ScotRail trains take around 50 minutes between Edinburgh and Glasgow Queen Street stations.
I would expect a time of around 5 hours and 13 minutes is possible.
This is slower than the typical 4 hours and 31 minutes of Avanti West Coast between Euston and Glasgow Central stations, but improvements to the signalling may reduce the time that Lumo takes between London and Edinburgh.
What Time Are The Last Train From Glasgow and Edinburgh To London?
These would appear to be the last trains from Glasgow and Edinburgh to London.
- The last Avanti West Coast train would appear to be the 18:40 from Glasgow Central, which gets in to London Euston at 23:40.
- The Caledonian Sleeper leaves at 23:40 from Glasgow Central, which gets in to London Euston at 07:00.
- The last LNER train for London King’s Cross, would appear to be the 19:37 from Edinburgh, which gets in to London King’s Cross at 01:14.
- The last LNER train for Leeds, would appear to be the 21:00 from Edinburgh, which gets in to Leeds at 00:42.
- The last LNER train for Newcastle, would appear to be the 22:00 from Edinburgh, which gets in to Newcastle at 01:14.
- The Caledonian Sleeper leaves at 23:40 from Edinburgh, which gets in to London Euston at 07:00.
Note.
- The timetable seems to assume, that if you are spending a day in Edinburgh or Glasgow and need to return to London, you will use the Caledonian Sleeper.
- Unless you use the Sleeper, you can’t see an evening football match and easily go home to anywhere South of Edinburgh.
- One of the last trains to arrive in London King’s Cross station is the 19:58 Lumo service from Edinburgh, which arrives at 01:00 in London King’s Cross station.
- Surprisingly, London King’s Cross station seems to have several trains moving in and out all night.
There’s certainly a large gap in the evening, where an extra service could run between Glasgow and London King’s Cross.
I wonder how late Lumo could bring a train into King’s Cross station?
- I came in once to King’s Cross at about 01:30 and still got a taxi home.
- There are also lots of 24-hour buses.
- There is little or no car parking.
I still think Lumo will operate a train as late as Network Rail will allow them.
Could Passengers Sleep In Lumo’s Seats?
I’ve certainly managed it. But then I’ve never had a problem falling asleep.
Does The Extended Service To Glasgow Pass The Granny’s Birthday Test?
Suppose it’s your granny’s birthday and you want to go to her family party, which is in the afternoon.
You should be able to take a morning train up to Glasgow and then take the late train back afterwards.
Conclusion
Lumo have spotted a gap in the timetable and they intend to fill it.
Unlocking Euston Station
I dread using Euston station.
The connections to the London Underground in the station, involve a long walk to or from your train and then outside the station to.
- The Northern and Victoria Lines just outside the station.
- The sub-surface lines at Euston Square station, which is a long walk.
There is no connection to the Lizzie Line.
I have probably written more project management software, than any other individual in the world.
Good project managers and probably a few bad ones too, talk about getting all your ducks in a row or doing everything in the right order.
If High Speed Two is going to terminate at Euston, then the first sub-project must be to connect Euston station properly to the Metropolitan, Circle and Hammersmith & City or sub-surface lines of the Underground, which have new spacious air-conditioned trains and run on a line that is digitally signally, so the capacity can be easily increased.
The sub-surface lines also link, the National Rail stations of Liverpool Street, Moorgate, Farringdon, King’s Cross, St. Pancras, Euston, Paddington, Victoria, Charing Cross and Blackfriars, and could be connected to Fenchurch Street and Marylebone. It also has links to the Lizzie Line.
Improve the interchanges and this marvelous Victorian system could unlock London’s transport system like no other.
Five years ago, a similar arrangement to that at St. Pancras was proposed with subways under Euston Road that linked to extended platforms at Euston Square Underground station, by means of lifts and escalators.
Why has this new link between National Rail at Euston and sub-surface Underground not been built? I estimate that it would have taken a couple of years and have fitted in with all the work being done in front of Euston station.
The current Mayor never mentions the project, but then it is a North London project, so it doesn’t interest him and his supporters.
The Design Of The Updated Euston Underground Station
Ian showed this visualisation of the updated Euston Underground station.
At a first look, it appears to be a very similar concept to the entrance to the Underground in front of St. Pancras station.
Click on the image to show it large and you can pick out the following.
- West is to the left and East is right.
- Much of the construction appears to replace the original car park and taxi rank.
- The upper level looks like where passengers enter and leave the station.
- The subway to Euston Square station and the new Gordon Street entrance joins to the upper level towards the Eastern end.
- There is grade access between the upper level and the High Speed Two concourse.
- There are lots of escalators to travel between levels. The square orange columns could be lift towers.
- The lower level is the Interchange/Ticket Hall level.
- The lower level is not much higher than the Charing Cross branch of the Northern Line.
- The design seems to make clever use of levels to make changing easier.
- The access between the lower level and the Charing Cross branch of the Northern Line at the Western end of the station, appears to be comprehensive and step-free.
- The access between the lower level and the Victoria Line and the Bank branch of the Northern Line, appears to use the current route, which will probably be upgraded to be fully step-free.
This second image shows the design from above the platforms of the conventional section of Euston station.
Click on the image to show it large and you can pick out the following.
- The complicated passages, escalators and lifts of the existing four platforms serving the Bank branch of the Northern Line and the Victoria Line.
- The cross passage connecting these lines to the platforms of the Charing Cross branch of the Northern Line.
- The two up and two down escalators leading to the existing ticket hall.
- The Charing Cross branch of the Northern Line curving in and away from the station. See the earlier map of the Underground lines.
- The eleven High Speed platforms on the West side of the station.
- The thirteen Classic platforms on the East side of the station.
- The new Northern entrance to the Underground between the two sets of platforms. How convenient!
- There appears to be a wide passage between the Northern and Southern entrances, with connections to the lines branching off.
- The subway to the new Gordon Street entrance is shown at the top of the image.
The design seems to have separated access to the two branches of the Northern line, by creating a new high-capacity route to the Charing Cross branch.
I also think, that the design allows the station to be built without disrupting passengers using the Underground and the current Euston station.
- A large hole for the station can be excavated, without touching existing access.
- It could then be fitted out section by section.
- Once the new access to the Charing Cross branch of the Northern Line is complete, the current access to the Northern and Victoria Lines can be refurbished.
Arriving At Euston
Imagine you are a passenger arriving from the North, who knows the Underground line, you need to take, you would then enter the Underground station using the new Northern entrance.
- For the Bank branch of the Northern Line or the Victoria Line, you would go through the existing ticket hall and down the escalators, much as you do now! Except that you’d enter the ticket hall on the other side from the East side of the passageway connecting the two entrances. New lifts appear to be shown.
- For the Charing Cross branch of the Northern Line, you would take the passages, lifts and escalators on the West side of the passageway connecting the two entrances.
- If you wanted the sub-surface lines, you would just keep going and take the new subway, which connects to the Eastern ends of the platforms at Euston Square station.
It will certainly do me fine, if I arrive at Euston, as I’ll walk through the subway and get in the front of any Eastbound train for Moorgate station, where being in the front is convenient for the exit and the nearby bus stop to my home.
This route will surely be one of the ways arriving passengers at Euston will get Crossrail to Abbey Wood, Canary Wharf and Shenfield stations. In Crossrail – Northern – Northern City Interchange At Moorgate Station, I show some visualisations of Moorgate station and the connectivity.
Where Is Handsacre Junction?
Handsacre Junction is where High Speed Two trains from London Euston and Birmingham will join the Trent Valley Line to complete their journeys via Stafford and Crewe.
This OpenRailwayMap shows the junction.
Note.
- The solid red track going diagonally across the map is the Trent Valley Line, which is a section of the West Coast Main Line.
- The station on the Trent Valley Line at the top of the map is Rugeley Trent Valley.
- The station on the Trent Valley Line at the bottom of the map is Lichfield Trent Valley.
- The dotted tracks running North-South show the proposed route of High Speed Two.
- Only the dashed sections of tracks will be built for Phase 1 of High Speed Two.
From the map, I estimate that that High Speed Two will join the Trent Valley Line at the mid-way point between the two stations.
According to Real Time Trains, the stations are these distances from Euston.
- Lichfield Trent Valley – 116.4 miles
- Rugeley Trent Valley – 124.4 miles
So this puts Handsacre Junction at 120.4 miles from Euston.
Searching the Internet, I find the distance between Euston and Handsacre Junction on High Speed Two as 192.77 km. or 119.8 miles.
It would appear that the High Speed Two route is 0.6 mile longer.
Euston And Handsacre Junction Times
This table shows Euston and Handsacre junction times at various speeds.
High Speed Two Average Speed – 205 mph – 35 mins.
Class 390 Train Average Speed – 140 mph – 51 mins.
Euston And Glasgow Central Times
If I assume, that the trains take the same three hours and 47 minutes between Handsacre junction and Glasgow Central as Class 390 trains do now, I get these times.
High Speed Two Average Speed – 205 mph – 4 hour and 22 mins.
Class 390 Train Average Speed – 140 mph – 4 hours and 38 mins.
Euston And Liverpool Lime Street Times
If I assume, that the trains take the same 71 minutes between Handsacre junction and Liverpool Lime Street as Class 390 trains do now, I get these times.
High Speed Two Average Speed – 205 mph – 1 hour and 46 mins.
Class 390 Train Average Speed – 140 mph – 2 hours and 2 mins.
Euston And Manchester Piccadilly Times
If I assume, that the trains take the same 66 minutes between Handsacre junction and Manchester Piccadilly as Class 390 trains do now, I get these times.
High Speed Two Average Speed – 205 mph – 1 hour and 41 mins.
Class 390 Train Average Speed – 140 mph – 1 hours and 57 mins.
Network Rail Objects To Wrexham To London Service
The title of this post, is the same as that of this article on the BBC.
This is the sub-heading.
Concerns have been raised about plans for a direct rail service between Wrexham and London, including fears over safety at level crossings.
These three paragraphs add details to the story.
Network Rail warned the line was already congested and there was not enough timetable capacity for extra services.
In a report, it said increased use would raise the risk of a collision at crossings along the route and that it could not support the application, put forward by a new open-access rail operator called the Wrexham, Shropshire and Midlands Railway (WSMR).
The new service would link Wrexham, Gobowen, Shrewsbury, Walsall and Coleshill up with the capital.
This Google Map shows the area of the crossing.
Note.
- Chirk station, which is fully-accessible via ramps, is at the top of the map.
- The railway between and running down the middle of the map.
- The railway has a maximum speed of 70 mph.
- The Aqueduct and the Viaduct crossing the valley of the River Ceirog together.
- The large caravan park.
- Chirk Castle Park.
If the Viaduct level crossing is in this area, it is a serious accident waiting to happen.
The BBC article says this about the crossing.
They include the Viaduct level crossing in Shropshire, which it said was “used by large groups and is also a hot spot for trespassing and fatalities”.
The operator said work would need to be carried out to make it safe.
North Shropshire MP Helen Morgan has previously spoken out on the safety of the crossing, which is close to the Chirk Viaduct.
She has written to Network Rail to request additional safety measures be put in place.
Network Rail said it had reviewed the safety of the crossing and brought forward plans to install crossing lights, which should be in place in December this year.
Note.
- I hope this is enough. But, I do know that the level crossing lights work well at Thurston station in Suffolk.
- It must help, that there is a bridge at the station.
The line between Wolverhampton and Wrexham, except for a short 15 mph section at Shrewsbury has at least a 70 mph maximum speed.
As electric trains, including battery-electric ones, have fast acceleration and deceleration would it not be possible for them to slow down for the level crossings?
This could even be done automatically using digital signalling.
Conclusion
I believe that this level crossing problem is solvable.
Lumo To Expand Scotland’s Rail Network With New London-Stirling Rail Route From Spring 2026
The title of this post is the same as this news item from Lumo.
These three bullet points act as sub-headings.
- Lumo has secured a new route connecting Stirling with London Euston, launching as early as Spring 2026, offering passengers five daily affordable services.
- The announcement comes as Lumo hosted a special event at Holyrood attended by MSPs and Scotland’s MPs, spotlighting Lumo’s contribution to enhancing rail connectivity for previously underserved communities in Scotland.
- The route will provide first-ever direct services to London for Whifflet, Greenfaulds, and Larbert, further boosting economic opportunities and travel options in Scotland.
This first paragraph adds some more details.
Lumo, the UK’s leading Open Access rail operator, today announced it has secured five Class 222 six-car trains for its forthcoming route between London Euston and Stirling, beginning as early as Spring 2026. This expansion aims to enhance travel choice and connectivity for passengers along the central belt of Scotland both to England and to Stirling, offering five daily services with the operator renowned for affordability and efficiency.
I have some thoughts.
What Is The Complete Route?
This is the complete route.
Lumo’s new route will link London Euston directly to Stirling, also calling at Milton Keynes, Nuneaton, Crewe, Preston, Carlisle, Lockerbie, Motherwell, Whifflet (serving Coatbridge), Greenfaulds (serving Cumbernauld) and Larbert.
It is fully-electrified and can support 125 mph running most, if not all, of the way.
There Are No Six-Car Class 222 Trains
Consider.
- Currently, five-car Class 222 trains seat 192 in Standard Class and 50 in First Class.
- Currently, seven-car Class 222 trains seat 236 in Standard Class and 106 in First Class.
- Lumo’s five-car Class 803 trains set 402 in Standard Class.
- Lumo’s trains have no First Class.
I estimate that a six-car Class 222 train, with all Standard Class seating would accommodate not far off the 402 seats of one of Lumo’s bog-standard Class 803 trains.
Having identical numbers of passengers on the two fleets, must surely bring operational advantages.
- A six-car Class 222 train could replace a five-car Class 803 train or vice-versa, if Lumo were short of trains.
- Class 222 trains are able to take the Great Northern and Great Eastern Joint Line and other diversions during times of engineering works.
- The Class 222 trains would be able to run between Euston and Rochdale.
- The Class 222 trains might be useful for developing services on routes without electrification.
In the future, a six-car Class 222 train could be directly replaced in Lumo’s fleet by a five-car battery-electric Class 803 train.
The Class 222 Trains Are Diesel-Powered
All the noise and vibration could be a problem, but if I am right about the interchangeability of the two fleets, then this gives some advantages too.
- Earlier delivery of Class 222 trains, than new Class 803 trains, may enable Lumo to start services between Euston and Stirling at an earlier date.
- Earlier delivery of Class 222 trains, may allow selective withdrawal of Class 803 trains for updating.
- A mixed fleet of diesel and electric trains may be able to run more services during engineering works, by using diversion routes without electrification.
- Short route extensions to Dundee or Perth could be tried to assess demand.
There could be some good reasons to get the Class 222 trains into service sooner rather than later.
Will The Diesel Class 222 Trains Be Replaced By Battery-Electric Class 803 Trains?
Although London And Edinburgh By Lumo Using the Joint Line Diversion, was also about Lumo’s proposed Euston and Rochdale service, it was mainly about using battery power to use the Great Northern and Great Eastern Joint Line to avoid engineering works or wiring problems.
Both train types have the following abilities.
- Ability to go between Stirling and Euston via the West Coast Main Line.
- Ability to go between Rochdale and Euston via the West Coast Main Line.
- Ability to go between Stirling and King’s Cross via the East Coast Main Line.
- Ability to go between Edinburgh and King’s Cross via the East Coast Main Line.
- Ability to handle the Great Northern and Great Eastern Joint Line on their own power.
- Ability to handle diversions of up to around a hundred miles on their own power.
As Lumo’s new battery-electric Class 803 trains are delivered, Lumo’s two Anglo-Scottish routes and the one to Rochdale can go all-electric.
Can Lumo Trains Run As Pairs?
I’ve not seen or heard if Lumo have done this, but as I wrote in Ten-Car Hull Trains, I’ve seen Lumo’s sister company Hull Trains run ten-car trains.
As Wikipedia says that both Class 222 and Class 803 trains can run in multiple formations with other trains from the same class, I have to assume it is possible, providing the Fat Controller agrees to the practice.
Has Heidi Alexander Really Said Yes?
After the launch at Holyrood, in front of MSPs and Scottish MPs, it would now be difficult to say No!
But then there’s a by-election to the Scottish Parliament in Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse on Thursday.
Is Lumo’s new route an easy drive from the constituency? A Scot, who has worked in the area said Yes!
Conclusion
I like FirstGroup’s plan to create a diesel fleet to introduce new services and back up their current ones, until the new battery-electric Class 803 trains are delivered.
Could High Speed Two Serve Blackpool North?
Consider.
- Blackpool North station is electrified and will have an electrified route to London Euston HS2 and Birmingham Curzon Street stations, when High Speed Two opens.
- Yesterday, both 11-car and 9-car Class 390 trains, which are longer than single High Speed Two classic-compatible trains, used Blackpool North station.
- Blackpool is noted for fresh air and fun.
- Blackpool needs leveling-up. Surely High Speed Two will help with this?
- Blackpool has a unique Modern and Ancient tramway to bring residents and visitors to High Speed Two.
I am fairly sure, that single High Speed Two class-compatible trains could use Blackpool North station.
But could another High Speed Two service have a path between London and Preston to serve Blackpool?
Because of the cancellation of Phase 2 of High Speed 2, there are spare paths on High Speed Two between London and the West Midlands.
If the core section of High Speed Two is extended Northwards to Crewe, as advocated by Dyan Perry of the High Speed Rail Group, that I wrote about in The Future Of HS2 Could Lie In Its Original Vision, this would create extra paths to Crewe.
It looks to me, that the tricky part of the route is between Crewe and Preston.
This diagram shows High Speed Two services, as they were originally envisaged before Phase 2 was discontinued.
Note.
- Trains to the left of the vertical black line are Phase 1 and those to the right are Phase 2.
- Full-Size trains are shown in blue.
- Classic-Compatible trains are shown in yellow.
- Blue circles are shown, where trains stop.
- The dotted circles are where trains split and join.
- In the red boxes routes alternate every hour.
Click on the diagram to enlarge it.
Note that if Phase 1 were to be completed to Crewe, there would be five full-size and five classic-compatible trains using the West Midlands and Crewe section of the High Speed Two route, of which five trains would terminate at Manchester Piccadilly HS2 station and two classic-compatible trains would terminate at Liverpool Lime Street.
So just three Scottish trains and one to Lancaster would go North of Warrington Bank Quay station, which would be an average of one train every fifteen minutes.
High Speed Two will be fully digitally signalled and I’m sure that trains could run as flights of two or more trains, a couple of minutes apart.
This would mean that a London and Blackpool North service could run say two minutes behind one of the London and Scotland services to Preston
- Between London and the West Midlands, there would be twelve trains per hour (tph).
- Between the West Midlands and Crewe, there would be also be twelve tph.
- Between Crewe and Preston, there would be five tph.
I believe it would be possible for High Speed Two to run a London and Blackpool North service, provided that the London Euston to Crewe core of High Speed Two is completed soon after Phase 1 is completed.
It should also be noted, that I believe the second Scottish service from London could also have a flight with another service. So could Barrow or Blackburn have a High Speed Two service from London?
The Future Of HS2 Could Lie In Its Original Vision
The title of this post, is the same as that of this article on Railway Gazette.
This is the sub-heading.
High Speed 2 should be rescoped to run from London Euston to Crewe, taking advantage of the lessons learned and supply chain foundations established during Phase 1, says Dyan Perry, Chair of the High Speed Rail Group.
The article has been written by Dyan Perry, who knows her railways and especially high speed ones well.
These two first paragraphs introduce her arguments.
High Speed 2 stands at a defining crossroads. Phase 1 from Old Oak Common to Birmingham has the green light, and under the new leadership of HS2 Ltd CEO Mark Wild the project is undergoing a positive and much needed ’reset’. With around 31 000 jobs currently supported, more than 75% of tunnelling completed and construction underway on two-thirds of HS2’s viaducts, momentum is building again.
This fresh injection of energy is welcome after years of shifting goalposts and cuts to the project’s scope. However, while Phase I pushes ahead, the handbrake has been pulled on the next critical phases of the project: the route from the West Midlands to Crewe and Old Oak Common to London Euston.
In the short term, this may appear fiscally sensible. However, as with all infrastructure investments, the project and potential returns must be viewed through a long-term lens. After all, a half-built railway moulded by short-term decision-making risks squandering investment to date and losing billions of pounds of taxpayers’ money.
The High Speed Rail Group (HSRG) has these recommendations.
- A “Euston to Crewe” Core.
- West Midlands to Crewe must be given the go-ahead before the powers to do so run out. This would provide much needed capacity on the West Coast Main Line.
- Use the lessons learned on Phase 1 to build West Midlands to Crewe more effectively.
- Build a streamlined, cost effective station at Euston.
- HSRG believes a concession let for a London to Birmingham and Crewe railway line, one that takes learning from the High Speed One financing model, could generate between £7·5bn and £10bn in concession value, a significant return for taxpayers.
High Speed Two needs a cohesive long term plan.
I very much agree with what Dyan and the HSRG are saying.
I also have some related thoughts.
High Speed East Coast
I am a Control Engineer by training and I’ve felt for some time, that the some of the bottlenecks on the East Coast Main Line to the South of Doncaster could be solved by intelligent digital signalling.
I believe that the major cities of the North-East of England and Eastern Scotland would be best served by direct high speed trains from London on the East Coast Main Line. I also think, that such an approach would deliver similar times to High Speed Two via Birmingham.
North of York
Just as stations on the West Coast to the North of Crewe will be served by High Speed Two and the West Coast Main Line, stations North of York will be served by trains going up the East Coast Main Line.
The Element Of Competition
I said earlier, that if a 30-year concession were to be sold for the West Coast Main Line, it could raise between £7.5bn and £10bn.
So why not sell a concession for the East Coast Main Line?
A further benefit, is that competition between the two concessions and the budget airlines, might bring down timings and prices, just as competition did in the Railway Races of 1888 and 1895.
High Speed North Wales
I have believed for some time, that there is a need for a zero-carbon (green) route between London and Dublin and ultimately between the Channel Tunnel and Dublin.
The last Conservative government promised to electrify Crewe and Holyhead along the North Wales Coast.
This route could deliver passengers to Holyhead for a zero-carbon high speed catamaran to Dublin.
The EU would be a beneficiary and might like to help fund the route.
The Anonymous Widower 